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Charging for Skins?

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sgtevmckay

Re: Charging for Skins?

Post by sgtevmckay »

Agreed
P2C
Posts: 45
Joined: November 13th, 2009, 10:22 pm
Location: near Würzburg, Germany

Re: Charging for Skins?

Post by P2C »

I completely agree with you in this thing. As Rainmeter is a totally free software and the developers probably put a lot of their time into it, they would be the ones that should get a donation. But I also understand if anyone wants to charge for his skin. The skin creators themselves also spend lots of time into making skins. So it's a bit mixed feelings for me on this side. But one thing I'm sure: you'll never get as many downloads for something which users have to pay as for something that's free. Sure, the skin looks nice and complete, I'm sure there has been lots of work put in, and in this case it's good to know the author will support the users with updates/fixes etc. But hey, there is a extremely huge variaty of skins which look a bit the same and probably have almost the same functionality. And are FREE.

As I'm making some skins myself, here's what I think about the whole stuff:

-I tried out Rainmeter as the software itself and all the skins that come with it because it is free.
-I then was happy with the variety of skins, but wanted to do something myself which has all the functionality I want. As I almost finished the skin I thought: "Hey, without all this free support of skins and the help over at the forums I wouldn't have been able to make this, why shouldn't I share my creation with those guys, too?"

-When I was almost ready to release it, there was only one thing missing: What about licenses?
Okay, I used the code of Enigma for example, so there wasn't that much to think about, but the Creative Commons license isn't something I'm just using because I have to, but I'm very happy with this whole thing was created and totally agree with the terms of this thing.

And, yes as the Creative Commons Attribution Noncommercial Share Alike license says, you are not allowed to charge for something which is based of something under this license. But is the skin really based of Enigma? Even if it would, I don't know if it is so easy to proof that ...

And I'm not really concentrating on r3ginald for this post, but for the whole "pay for a skin thing" itself. We'll see how this thing is coming along :)

btw: this post took me that long, that there are alot of other posts which haven't been here when I started writing. Forgive me writing things twice in here :p
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Benjamin Linus
Posts: 163
Joined: July 12th, 2009, 4:05 pm
Location: The Island

Re: Charging for Skins?

Post by Benjamin Linus »

jsmorley wrote:We need to keep this civil and fact based. r3ginald is a good guy and there will be no bashing or questioning his motives. At the end of the day folks will "vote with their wallets" on this issue.
Fair point.
If this was to become the norm it surely would spiral out of control.
JSM respect!
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Alex2539
Rainmeter Sage
Posts: 642
Joined: July 19th, 2009, 5:59 am
Location: Montreal, QC, Canada

Re: Charging for Skins?

Post by Alex2539 »

It doesn't matter if someone charges for a skin. If they believe that their work is good enough that people will shell out for it, then it's their prerogative to ask them to.

What I don't agree with is the fact that some of those images and potentially some of that code may have come from outside sources. Depending on the licenses of those original sources, commercial distribution may in fact be illegal. For example, if Enigma material was in fact used here, then I know that the license Kaelri chose is a "Creative Commons Attribution-Non-Commercial-Share Alike" license. That means that it can be freely used and distributed and long as Kaelri is credited as the original author and it can not be used commercially. If this is the case, the only thing to do would be to contact the original owners of the material and have them deal with it.

Regardless of any personal feelings on the matter it is not a third party's place to take matters into their own hands.
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shiraz07
Posts: 56
Joined: June 21st, 2009, 3:00 pm

Re: Charging for Skins?

Post by shiraz07 »

Totally up to the individual.You pays your money & takes your choice.Not for me but everyone to their own.
r3ginald
Posts: 12
Joined: June 12th, 2009, 6:45 pm
Location: California

Re: Charging for Skins?

Post by r3ginald »

I have purposely waited this long to respond because I wanted to see everyone’s response before I say anything. First off, I want to thank everyone for their input.
I solely take 100% responsibility for my actions. I am glad that this was brought up as I was unsure if charging for this theme was the right thing to do. I have a couple of reasons for doing such a thing.
1) I see people charging for their blogspot/blogger/tumblr/wordpress themes all the time but I am positive they were not the founders or creators of HTML and other types of programming language. So why can’t I charge for Rainmeter?
2) I am a college student. I am in need for money. I understand that charging is ridiculous which is why I only set it at $2. I also understand that not everyone has $2 to spare.
3) Haiti. I was going to donate 15%-20% of my earnings to the Haiti Fund.
4) I spend countless of hours on all my themes and thought that maybe I deserve some kind of compensation. But now I realize…who am I to say that I spend hours on a theme when the devs probably have spent more hours just trying to create Rainmeter?
5) I wanted to see if people will actually buy a theme I make.

Before I say anything else, I want to say a few things first. Because of popular opinion…
1) I have chosen not to charge. My main reason? Charging would just bring the Rainmeter community down to a halt. Rainmeter is an open-source program and I want everyone to be able to download my themes freely. I don’t want Rainmeter to die because of what I just did.
2) I don’t want a competition to start. Best skin = more $. That should not happen. I want Rainmeter to remain a free program because I know if I were in a buyers shoes and I see this skin or theme that is pretty nice but it costs $5 or something, I would be very disappointed I won’t be able to get it because I can’t afford it.
3) I have already refunded everyone as soon as I read the forum.
4) Therefore, I will make my themes at my own leisure.

Also, some people have accused me of using the popular Enigma theme, modified it, and named it DarkStep. That is 100% false. I did not use Enigma as an example to make this theme, nor did I even look at its coding. DarkStep was 99.9% all me. I used the Rainmeter Help section to figure all my problems and ask questions around the forum. However, I can’t say that I created everything to make my theme, which is the main reason why I shouldn’t be charging. I used a couple of eclipse icons made by chrfb. I have looked at codes from other themes and my own themes and see how certain thing was done.
That being said, someone earlier said that anyone who has created a skin is doing so off the back of a lot of hard work put in by so and so. I totally agree. But wasn’t Rainmeter based off the hard work of the originators of programming in Microsoft?
I don’t regret doing this. I think it was a good experience and example for future events. I don’t know if it’s better if the first time this happened to is me or a random individual who has just started to use Rainmeter. But anyway, I want to apologize for the inconvenience I have caused and hope this will provide a good example for future references.
My Tumblog
Everything I have made is located at my blog. Visit for my latest updates, skins, themes/etc.
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TEAM V.I.S.O.R.
devART
sgtevmckay

Re: Charging for Skins?

Post by sgtevmckay »

Thank you r3ginald for your words, and of course your patients with what unfortunately seemed to turn into flaming at some point. I am certain my comments were no help. :Embarrassed:

r3ginald: I want you to know that we bashed this to death in the IRC Chat, and there are many strong opinions for and against, ultimately there were many that would give you your shot at it.
To say we were surprised is an understatement, so the responses initially were emotional, and not thought out.

being a college student at anytime is hard, and my heart, hopes, and prayers to your success.
To that end I strongly make the recommendation that you ask for Donations, I encourage it with many people.
A skinners work is not easy, if it was, we would all make our own skins, there should be some recompense for that excellent work :thumbsu:

It is my hope that you will continue to be a member of the Rainmeter Community and that you do not feel we have shut you out in any manner; You are still welcome here.
No need for apologies, no inconvenience to any members here ;)
Please do not feel you were placed on the spot, it was probably going to happen to someone at some time, but many of us never considered what you presented.
I still give you great points for your ingenuity in attempting to find a way to overcome your financial needs.
It took, thought, imagination, and guts
I always am proud of that, and the entrepreneurial spirit, for this I salute you in your efforts.
I do not know what your major is, but i hope it has something to do with business, and building your own...You will do fine :love:

On the upside: You definitely got our attentions and made us think, and that is never a bad thing :p
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Alex2539
Rainmeter Sage
Posts: 642
Joined: July 19th, 2009, 5:59 am
Location: Montreal, QC, Canada

Re: Charging for Skins?

Post by Alex2539 »

I used a couple of eclipse icons made by chrfb.
You should know that regardless of what everyone else believes this is your only real misstep. Since those icons are under the CC license, money shouldn't factor into anything they're used in. Otherwise, your request was perfectly reasonable. It's just strange since it's also sort of the first of its kind. Congratulations on braving new territory ;).

I think everything that needs to be said has been said. R3ginald is well within his rights to ask for payment for his work. The community is well within their right to be weirded out by this.

Since this is a potentially touchy subject, I'm going to close the topic before it degrades.
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