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installer beta version sucks

Get help with installing and using Rainmeter.
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jsmorley
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Re: installer beta version sucks

jsmorley » March 1st, 2018, 8:32 pm

dvo wrote:i had some but all new things and altered versions are gone 4 now
If you uninstalled Rainmeter and deleted all your skins without backing them up, I fail to see how you expected any other result. Nothing to do with Windows Defender or what version of Rainmeter you are installing. I mean, it may be that Defender didn't allow a new Rainmeter\Skins folder to be created in Documents, but it wasn't Defender that deleted your existing ones to begin with.
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jsmorley
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Re: installer beta version sucks

jsmorley » March 1st, 2018, 8:46 pm

By the way, you are right.

If you enable Controlled Folder Access in Windows Security Center, then your Documents folder is one that is "protected", and Rainmeter can't create the Rainmeter\Skins folder there.

IF you do a "clean" install, then Rainmeter will install and run, but you will just get a warning that no skins can be found.

You will need to add an exception for Rainmeter.exe in one of two places.

1) In the settings for that Controlled Folder Access feature
2) As an "exclusion" in the folders that Defender scans for viruses.

I would think the first would be safest.
1.jpg
Then the very next time you run Rainmeter, the folder will in fact be created with the default skins and all will be well.

Of course this is going to be particularly annoying and confusing for a brand-new Rainmeter user, as nothing in Windows tells you it did this, and there is nothing intuitive about the result that points you in this direction. Thanks Microsoft. Thank goodness the default for that crap is "off". It is that way because the assumption is that someone who turns it on understands the implications, and how to manage things in that restrictive environment. Let's hope they don't decide to default it to "on" in the future.

The only other option, if you insist in turning on this feature, is to install Rainmeter in "portable" mode, so it doesn't try to use your Documents folder.
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jsmorley
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Re: installer beta version sucks

jsmorley » March 1st, 2018, 9:18 pm

We will explore options to detect and deal with this in the installer. There is nothing we can do to override this behavior, as that is sorta the point of it. However, we might be able to "detect" it, and either default Rainmeter to "portable" mode, or pop up a warning with some instructions on how to fix it, or something. We need to chew on it.

It's nothing to do with the beta, or any particular version of Rainmeter by the way. The result will be the same with any version, now and in the future.

It's the price you pay for paranoia...
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dvo
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Re: installer beta version sucks

dvo » March 1st, 2018, 9:37 pm

rebuild most of my sh#t and it's back to basic , and i just put it off now in defender but what i saw
was few guys with the same problem on the form... and they did a lot trying to fix maybe this was the problem of that...
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jsmorley
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Re: installer beta version sucks

jsmorley » March 2nd, 2018, 3:16 pm

We are exploring alternatives to address this. Nothing decided yet, and may not be until we see what if anything they do with this in the next Spring Creators Update of Windows arriving soon.

It's quite tricky. While this Controlled Folder Access setting is "off" by default today, if a user turns it on, or if worse yet, Windows decides to default it to "on", this is going to cause massive headaches.

Rainmeter will install fine, but won't be able to create the Skins folder when it is first run. In addition, we currently have .rmskin files being created on the Desktop when you use the tool to create them, and the Desktop is also a "protected" folder with that setting.

Reacting to this is going to be complicated to get right, and it might be impossible to make it entirely "seamless" for the end-user. Can't imagine that having to manually go set up "exclusions" for Rainmeter.exe and SkinInstaller.exe in Windows Security Center is going to be popular.

Another option is to change where the Skins folder is created and managed. Might have to move it out of the "controlled" Documents folder. We are considering moving it to the root C:\Users\YourName folder, which is not protected by this, but we are going to have to give careful thought about how we migrate "existing" Rainmeter users to this. We can't ignore them, as someone could "turn on" this security setting at any time, and Rainmeter would immediately start acting up. No new skins could be created, no skins could be edited, all very ugly.

We will see. Windows may improve how this feature works, as a simple pop-up that says "This app wants to write to a controlled folder, add the app to exclusions?" would pretty much solve everything. If that doesn't happen, and the feature gets more popular, or more enforced by Windows, we are going to have to take action.

Microsoft is determined to slowly, over time, destroy the desktop as we know it, and force everything to be in the "walled garden" of the Microsoft Store and certified, signed, vetted Universal Windows Apps. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss...

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
- Benjamin Franklin
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fonpaolo
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Re: installer beta version sucks

fonpaolo » March 2nd, 2018, 4:04 pm

I'm seeing more little applications (and not only) increasingly giving up with Windows 10, many of them only because at every new "update" there's something broken and it's becoming worse each time more and more, requiring a lot of work only to try to solve what Microsoft has broken.

I can understand that nowadays, to use a computer, you don't need to know how it works (at all), since he does everything on his own, so why bother to display most of the functions, better hide them, since there's no need to modify anything, it's so "cool", but in reality so flat and impersonal, just to be polite.

Oh, probably you're aware of another possible problem with Windows, it will start to block and uninstall every "scareware" found installed...
For the moment the target is software for "optimization" and so on, but in future, who knows what kind of software Microsoft will decide to include in his list.
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SilverAzide
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Re: installer beta version sucks

SilverAzide » March 2nd, 2018, 6:14 pm

jsmorley wrote:We are exploring alternatives to address this.
How about:
PS> Set-MpPreference -EnableControlledFolderAccess Disabled

;-)
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jsmorley
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Re: installer beta version sucks

jsmorley » March 2nd, 2018, 9:38 pm

SilverAzide wrote:How about:
PS> Set-MpPreference -EnableControlledFolderAccess Disabled

;-)
It's not up to us to tell people how to secure their computer.
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SilverAzide
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Re: installer beta version sucks

SilverAzide » March 3rd, 2018, 3:11 am

Yes... just being my usual facetious self. :)
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kyriakos876
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Re: installer beta version sucks

kyriakos876 » March 7th, 2018, 2:03 am

jsmorley wrote:We are exploring alternatives to address this. Nothing decided yet, and may not be until we see what if anything they do with this in the next Spring Creators Update of Windows arriving soon.

It's quite tricky. While this Controlled Folder Access setting is "off" by default today, if a user turns it on, or if worse yet, Windows decides to default it to "on", this is going to cause massive headaches.
Spring Creators Update, as developed up to today 7 March 2018, does not have this featured to "on" by default, but it does have an indicator saying that's it's advised to turn it on which is a typical way of Microsoft saying "it's going to be on by default in feature updates" and later on will probably not even have an "off" option. Typical Microsoft.... Anyhow, for now you don't have to worry for the next 1-2 major updates but yea... A solution will be needed later on.