It is currently August 10th, 2020, 4:19 pm

⭐ Weather.com

Post your work-in-progress and completed skins to share and discuss.
User avatar
jsmorley
Developer
Posts: 21235
Joined: April 19th, 2009, 11:02 pm
Location: Fort Hunt, Virginia, USA

Re: ⭐ Weather.com

Post by jsmorley »

dgmele wrote: June 17th, 2020, 1:52 am This skin uses a similar idea but replaces the high | low temp to "Low Tonight" temp.

Low Tonight.png

You can view it at https://www.deviantart.com/dmele/art/Today-845696032
Nice looking skin.
User avatar
nbtc971
Posts: 13
Joined: May 22nd, 2020, 6:10 am

Re: ⭐ Weather.com

Post by nbtc971 »

Ok that makes sense, I just never noticed it before all the issues started a couple of weeks ago. Thanks for the replies.
User avatar
Yincognito
Posts: 2223
Joined: February 27th, 2015, 2:38 pm
Location: Terra Yincognita

Re: ⭐ Weather.com

Post by Yincognito »

SilverAzide wrote: June 17th, 2020, 12:26 am[...] Once it is night (which weather.com has decided starts at 3 or 4? PM) [...]
Yeah, it's not about the night, it's the fact that at 3 or 4 PM the maximum temperature and all the "daytime" / "maximum" measurements have already happened and weather.com removes them from its data. So, basically, it's partly what jsmorley said about those measurements being in the past (thus, not suited for a forecast) but also partly about the fact that those represent the "maximums" for the day which only drop in values after 3 or 4 PM. The only odd thing about it is their removal from the data, as the principle on which they are removed is actually quite logical.
User avatar
jsmorley
Developer
Posts: 21235
Joined: April 19th, 2009, 11:02 pm
Location: Fort Hunt, Virginia, USA

Re: ⭐ Weather.com

Post by jsmorley »

Yincognito wrote: June 17th, 2020, 3:22 pm Yeah, it's not about the night, it's the fact that at 3 or 4 PM the maximum temperature and all the "daytime" / "maximum" measurements have already happened and weather.com removes them from its data. So, basically, it's partly what jsmorley said about those measurements being in the past (thus, not suited for a forecast) but also partly about the fact that those represent the "maximums" for the day which only drop in values after 3 or 4 PM. The only odd thing about it is their removal from the data, as the principle on which they are removed is actually quite logical.
Right. I think their take on it is that "historical" information for today has no place in a "forecast". This goes for ALL the information related to "Today Day" after 4pm. The only item that is a bit of a hassle is the "high" temperature for today, which a lot of folks would still like to display after 4pm. That can be solved by using the value for @CurrentTemperatureMaxSince7AM, which more or less ends up "storing" the high temperature for the day AFTER 4pm, since it is unlikely that it is ever going to get any hotter after that.

So it's up to you and the design of your skin. When all the "Today Day" information disappears, you can use that @CurrentTemperatureMaxSince7AM as the "high" for today, or just put "--" or leave it blank if, like weather.com, you say "who cares what temperature it WAS?".
User avatar
SilverAzide
Posts: 927
Joined: March 23rd, 2015, 5:26 pm

Re: ⭐ Weather.com

Post by SilverAzide »

Man... are you guys living on the same planet as me? The "maximums" don't always happen during the day, cold fronts and warm fronts move through all the time whenever they feel like. Plenty of nights are warmer than days... doesn't happen real often, but it happens. What DOES happen is TWC stops sending "forecast" data when there's nothing more to forecast, as the day is essentially over and any "day forecast" is not applicable. They call this "night" for some reason, which is a little annoying when the sun is still shining.

Note the high of the day was at 1AM:
Annotation 2020-06-17 124630.png
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Gadgets DeviantArt More...
User avatar
Yincognito
Posts: 2223
Joined: February 27th, 2015, 2:38 pm
Location: Terra Yincognita

Re: ⭐ Weather.com

Post by Yincognito »

jsmorley wrote: June 17th, 2020, 3:26 pm Right. I think their take on it is that "historical" information for today has no place in a "forecast". This goes for ALL the information related to "Today Day" after 4pm. The only item that is a bit of a hassle is the "high" temperature for today, which a lot of folks would still like to display after 4pm. That can be solved by using the value for @CurrentTemperatureMaxSince7AM, which more or less ends up "storing" the high temperature for the day AFTER 4pm, since it is unlikely that it is ever going to get any hotter after that.

So it's up to you and the design of your skin. When all the "Today Day" information disappears, you can use that @CurrentTemperatureMaxSince7AM as the "high" for today, or just put "--" or leave it blank if, like weather.com, you say "who cares what temperature it WAS?".
Yes, indeed. For all the hassle that parsing weather data causes to us once in a while, I decided that on some stuff (like the inconsistent daylong / dayshort at 3 or 4 AM or the missing daytime / daymax data after 3 or 4 PM) it's best to leave it as it is and as weather.com provides it, and not bother trying to "fix" it. But then, as you said, most folks want things to be flawless from their point of view ... which might not be what weather.com rates as flawless, from a more or less scientifical point of view.

I'm helped in that (just like in the area of lines and measures quantity in my skin) by the dynamic variable and scroll based structure in my skins, which allows me to "reuse" measures and variables. That's truly a godsend for reducing the redundancy in the code, and partially the reason for not bothering with the 3 / 4 PM issue.
User avatar
jsmorley
Developer
Posts: 21235
Joined: April 19th, 2009, 11:02 pm
Location: Fort Hunt, Virginia, USA

Re: ⭐ Weather.com

Post by jsmorley »

SilverAzide wrote: June 17th, 2020, 4:57 pm Man... are you guys living on the same planet as me? The "maximums" don't always happen during the day, cold fronts and warm fronts move through all the time whenever they feel like. Plenty of nights are warmer than days... doesn't happen real often, but it happens. What DOES happen is TWC stops sending "forecast" data when there's nothing more to forecast, as the day is essentially over and any "day forecast" is not applicable. They call this "night" for some reason, which is a little annoying when the sun is still shining.

Note the high of the day was at 1AM:

Annotation 2020-06-17 124630.png
Yes, but @CurrentTemperatureMaxSince7AM is still correct in any case.

I guess you can drive yourself crazy with semantics, but when it says "night", it's not trying to imply that it is "night" right now, just that the "forecast" it is providing is for the night. Forecasts are about the "future".
User avatar
Yincognito
Posts: 2223
Joined: February 27th, 2015, 2:38 pm
Location: Terra Yincognita

Re: ⭐ Weather.com

Post by Yincognito »

SilverAzide wrote: June 17th, 2020, 4:57 pm Man... are you guys living on the same planet as me? The "maximums" don't always happen during the day, cold fronts and warm fronts move through all the time whenever they feel like. Plenty of nights are warmer than days... doesn't happen real often, but it happens. What DOES happen is TWC stops sending "forecast" data when there's nothing more to forecast, as the day is essentially over and any "day forecast" is not applicable. They call this "night" for some reason, which is a little annoying when the sun is still shining.

Note the high of the day was at 1AM:

Annotation 2020-06-17 124630.png
Check these two documents:
- API Standard V3:
API - Standard - v3 - Forecast - 5 Day Daily Forecast for Personal Weather Station Owners .pdf
- Weather XML Data Feed:
guide.pdf
On the 1st, read the note on the first page. On the 2nd (yeah, I know, it's outdated, but still), read the section 8.6 Forecasts.
I know these don't answer the question as to why it's like it is, but the notification regarding this is there. All we can do is to speculate with a more or less degree of accuracy on the matter, as only weather.com know exactly the reasoning behind this. In my view, that reasoning is surely based on something. :confused:
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
User avatar
SilverAzide
Posts: 927
Joined: March 23rd, 2015, 5:26 pm

Re: ⭐ Weather.com

Post by SilverAzide »

Yincognito wrote: June 17th, 2020, 5:17 pm Check these two documents:
- API Standard V3:
API - Standard - v3 - Forecast - 5 Day Daily Forecast for Personal Weather Station Owners .pdf
- Weather XML Data Feed:
guide.pdf
On the 1st, read the note on the first page. On the 2nd (yeah, I know, it's outdated, but still), read the section 8.6 Forecasts.
I know these don't answer the question as to why it's like it is, but the notification regarding this is there. All we can do is to speculate with a more or less degree of accuracy on the matter, as only weather.com know exactly the reasoning behind this. In my view, that reasoning is surely based on something. :confused:
Yes! I found that note a while ago too!
PLEASE NOTE: The daypart object as well as the temperatureMax field OUTSIDE of the daypart object will appear as null in the API after 3:00pm Local Apparent Time.
That's why I was thinking that subtracting 3 hours from the "observation time" would always return the proper day/month names. However, the part they don't seem to explain is what the definition of "Local Apparent Time" is. I don't think it is the same as "local time", in that I could swear I saw the day/night switchover happening at 4pm sometimes. I have a suspicion that "Local Apparent Time" does NOT include any Daylight Saving Time adjustment, so when DST is in effect, the switchover happens at 4PM in that location. RIght now it's at 3AM/3PM for sure, but come DST time, I'm not sure. Just have to wait and see, I suppose...
Gadgets DeviantArt More...
User avatar
Yincognito
Posts: 2223
Joined: February 27th, 2015, 2:38 pm
Location: Terra Yincognita

Re: ⭐ Weather.com

Post by Yincognito »

SilverAzide wrote: June 17th, 2020, 4:57 pmThey call this "night" for some reason, which is a little annoying when the sun is still shining.
Well, it's not actually "night", it's "tonight", really - which has nothing to do with the sun still shining. I get what you say and I agree from a "commoner" / "civilian" (i.e. not involved in the profession of doing those forecasts) point of view, but for weather.com the "today" starts at 7 AM (even if the sun already rose before, in summer days) and the "tonight" probably around 7 PM (even if the sun didn't yet set in summer days). Another possibility is that those 3 AM / 4 AM (day name thingy) and those 3 PM / 4 PM (day forecast thingy) "anomalies" are related, maybe something regarding centralizing / updating stuff on their servers for the next periods. Just my 2 cents. :???:

P.S. It's not like you're left with no data for the 3 PM - 7 PM period, as one still has the hourly forecasts, and of course, the observation conditions.